Lawrence Bishnoi Speaks: Exclusive Interview with ABP News (Part 1, Oct 2024)

This exclusive interview features our beloved brother Lawrence Bishnoi, conducted by renowned journalist Jagwinder Patial of ABP News. Recorded in October 2024, this is Part 1 of their powerful conversation.

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Lawrence Bishnoi: Sir, he had 15-16 national medals. We friends used to study, then we ourselves thought of taking up arms. I was imprisoned so my brothers who were outside tried.

Interviewer: In 2014 you were caught for the first time. You ran away from near Mohali. How did that happen and how were you caught? That is where your most notorious side started in 2014.

Lawrence: My uncle's son was murdered. Sir, when I was going to the hearing, I ran away from the police at that time but was caught later in Fazilka’s village.

Interviewer: No, you went to Nepal. How were you caught from Nepal and then came back to Delhi?

LB: Sir, we were bringing weapons from there (Nepal) and were caught with weapons.

IN: How do you get weapons so easily? How did you become so powerful? You were very young then.

LB: We found contacts in jail.

In: Now it seems safer to stay in jail than outside.

LB: No sir, we want them to release us but now no one is releasing us. There is no hearing happening. Such a misconception has been spread in the media that we are the only villains surviving in the world.

In: Do you get all the news from the media inside?

LB: Yes sir, we have newspapers installed there, newspapers come in the cell.

In: You yourself get to know more things from them, what is happening, that much stuff does not get printed in the newspapers.

LB: Yes sir, whether the phone is working or not, then without phone, from newspapers we get to know, sir.

In: When did you send Sachin, your nephew, abroad and how did you send him abroad?

LB: No sir, he went through his sources, I mean my younger brother, and he used to be in touch with my brother, so after that he called Sachin abroad.

In: How was Sachin caught in Azerbaijan?

LB: He was retain, sir I do not have knowledge about this, how was he caught.

In: Is there any such black page of life that you want to share with us?

LB: Sir, I want to say this sir, by listening to one-sided things, you are making us villains, sir. The main thing is that you have created so much noise about this Sidhu, you should see that he raised his voice against some injustice, he used to speak very boldly. About which issue did he speak boldly when he was alive till then, did he ever speak about any crime or about the drugs spreading in Punjab? Did he ever speak about anti-gangsterism or against terrorism? He must have said something good to someone, sometimes a clip of this will be shown on stage. Did he ever speak against Pakistan or did he ever speak against the death of our soldiers?

In: Did you speak against?

LB: You said sir, this is the first time we speak against Pakistan, we are also against Khalistan. This is the first time I got a chance to speak with you, I did not get a chance to speak, I am against them sir, tell me.

In: Why you are against Khalistan?

LB: I am a nationalist man sir, I am a patriotic man, not me sir, all of my gang are from the country, we are against everyone.

In: What kind of patriotism is this that sends one on the path of crime?

LB: Crime, I committed the crime out of frustration. Absolutely.

In: If there is any benefit in committing crime like this, then here everyone, I mean since independence, everyone has been accounting for his crimes on his own.

LB: Sir, the same mistake happened, I am serving the sentence sir, it has been years and it is not that we are asking for any compensation from anyone. We made mistakes so we are suffering and those who were roaming outside despite making mistakes, God punished them.

In: You said that you are against Pakistan, you are against Khalistan. Were you against Khalistan from before or you were against Khalistan after the murder of Sidhu Moosewala?

LB: Already there.

In: What happened to you that you felt that this is not right? You must not have even been born when Khalistan would happen, you were born in 92.

LB: We think that we do not want the country to be divided, we were young but we are educated about our country, sir. We have knowledge of our country, sir, what is right and what is wrong. Now if someone tells you that Kerala has to be separated, then what is your attachment to Kerala? But you must want that our country should not be divided.

IN: You say that I will never come into politics, you talk like a politician.

LB: For the first time I have said something somewhere, sir. I am not saying anything about politics with an agenda. You asked me so I told you. I am not talking about any pre-planned things, I am reading after writing.

In: And what do you want to say, tell me. Then it should not happen that you contacted us and something was left out. I am giving you a chance. Whatever you want to say, you just want to say.

LB: That sir we are not terrorists or we are not against the country, sir. They caused harm to our brothers, so our brothers like Goldy or Sachin caused harm to them and we are not making me a terrorist. That Deepak boy used to be in our gang earlier, sir, later he left and went away. If he got involved with someone else, if he got involved with anyone, we have nothing to do with him, it's fine. If any anti-national person is there, we have nothing to do with anyone, it was our personal matter, it was for money or anything else, we did not kill him for fame. Our brothers were murdered, we used to kill him earlier. He was roaming around in Chandigarh like this, our brothers were murdered. He was supporting our anti-gang going against us in everything, that's why we and we are not anti-national people, sir. Maybe there was some talk about drugs somewhere in Pakistan or someone from there has sent something through drone. Whether it is a case or you are contacting someone there, it should go out somewhere sir and even if all the cases are filed, I am not saying that whether a case should be filed or nothing else is filed, whatever case may be filed, we should put forward our point in whatever way it is filed. I used to tell you that we are not anti-national that we have committed any mistakes. Fights among ourselves here or in the university or in the state or anywhere, or gang wars, we are serving the punishment for that, sir. We have been in jail for years and are serving the punishment for that, but till date we have not taken any step against the country nor have we thought of taking any step against the country. And we are against those people who do that, we are also against those who go against the country. If we ever want to be useful to the country, then today if anything happens, we will be useful to the country, that is, we will not go against the country.

In: If you stop crime, then I think that will also be useful for the country. The police is after you 24 hours a day, so much crime is happening, all this will stop the country from getting involved in such things, we have become victims.

LB: Sir, it is not a crime, we are fighting for our pride, we are not committing any crime. If such an environment is created, then we will not be alone, you will meet us like this, sir. I promise, because you will feel that we are the only ones ruining the palace, then nothing like this will happen.

In: It is not that you think that if even if I stop this thing, your rival gangs will not leave you, otherwise it has become your compulsion that you have to do this?

LB: Sir, there is no such story of them, nor we were so afraid of them. They have killed our brothers illegitimately, sir. If they lay hands on some good person who is from our gang, our brother, someone strong, then there will be pressure. But the thing is that they killed our illegitimate brothers like this and we are not afraid of anything. Yes, they will also come out. If they ever come, then it will be known. But we are not afraid of such people.

In: Do you want to become an underworld don, don't you?

LB: Sir, I want to remain in the condition in which I am. If anyone of me gets punished, I will hunt him down. If he ever comes out, I will build a cowshed (gao shala), I will serve the cows and there is no agenda.

In: When should we expect to come out? When will this cowshed be built? When will you give up crime, when will you come out of jail? Whether you come or not, that is in the hands of the law.

LB: We will build it from the jail itself, sir. I have a younger brother, he is getting it built, sir. The land that comes in his share, if I ever get a chance, I will also build. I will get it made and some name in politics, social service, someone, someone poor, someone weak, if he is being oppressed, then definitely you will find me standing with them and some in politics and some in something else.

In: So your brother has gone abroad?

LB: You must be getting calls from there. I am in jail sir, so what are the restrictions on him?

In: Do you know that your brother has gone?

LB: Sir, I have talked to him a couple of times since he went to America.

LB: It may be that Lawrence will need him, so after Goldie, Anmol also started running a gang.

In: Sir, he was first made to spend four years in jail, from 18 years to 22 years. I was sent to jail at the age of 21. Now I am 30 years old and he was sent to jail at the age of 18. He came out at 22, then went in and out sir. 18 cases have been filed against him.

In: He must have done something.

LB: In one case a case was filed against him and he also suffered the punishment, by the way, in some affair.

In: In spite of 18 cases filed against him, how did he go abroad?

LB: He must have gone on a fake passport after getting his passport made.

IN: Good you accept it very frankly that you must have gone on a fake passport.

LB: Sir, he must have gone just like that, sir. How else would the poor guy go? Here they were involving him in everything. A day before that a murder case was filed against him.

In: Do you think that all your people and all of them have been booked in false cases?

LB: False cases have been filed against my brother, sir.

In: Did you ever try to put this point in front of the police or anyone that these cases are false?

LB: Sir, at that time the police did not file it. Otherwise sir, how will the judiciary file a case, sir?

In: Only the police files it, but there must be some basis like this, right? In the air, so the case would not have been filed.

LB: They filed case against him because of me.

In: So because of you, your family is also troubled because of you. Your mother, your father never says that Lawrence, because of you we also have to face problems? You had a lot of property, why did you go into the world of crime?

LB: Sir, he says many times. What can you do sir, it has been a long time since I met father, sir. Mother comes to meet me in jail.

In: Mother never said to end all this?

LB: She says sir, whenever we meet, they say sir, I will try sir, we are also going to fight. Circumstances never turned around to make you turn around.

In: You can become a good person. You should come out of all these things. You are educated, you have energy. Use this energy in some good work because the fight that you have started is not going to end well. Being elder to you, I can give you this advice.

LB: Sir, I will definitely try. If I become good, you will meet me somewhere outside in a good place. Otherwise, you can read about us at such a place.

In: Lawrence, we also end this conversation with you with the hope that the next time we meet you, we will be outside the jail and you have come out of this world of crime. We request you that there is nothing in crime. This bloodshed only destroys homes and families. Come out of this destruction and the way darkness happened in Sidhu Moosewala's house, there should not be darkness in other houses. So, leave the world of crime and live a normal life. Thank you very much.